New Review Posted: Vampire: The Masquerade: Bloodlines

Daniel Weissenberger · 04-20-2005, 02:54 AM

It looked like we were going to be one colon short this week, but luckily Matt Weise opted to review Vampire: The Masquerade: Bloodlines:

"I don't think 3D RPG's work. The number-based systems of old pen & paper games have not transitioned well into the realm of three dimensions. Back in the days of 2D these number systems still made sense, but now they just get in the way. Games like System Shock 2 and Morrowind might be critically acclaimed, but they don't really solve the problem of how a number-based world and a physics-based world can coexist. Fun or not, these are still games where you can walk up to someone, stick a sword through their brain, and it only amounts to "attack power + weapon power = damage" when it should amount to dead body on the ground with a sword sticking out of its head. "

The rest of the review is right here.

Daniel Weissenberger · 10-12-2005, 01:21 AM

And Now Hias Wrba has his own opinions on the game, findable here.

Sajon · 10-12-2005, 12:23 PM

Heh. Well, I'll admit my criticisms of Bloodlines are more criticisms of the genre than of the game. However, I do think that 3D stat-driven RPG's require a more specified kind of videogame literacy than many other genres. Hias is right that all games require a certain level of videogame literacy, but some more than others. More importantly, some have literacy requirements based on conventions that are, to say the least, counter-intuitive.

I'm not saying people who "just like vampires" couldn't enjoy Bloodlines. However, I think there's a much higher probability of them being turned away from Bloodlines than, say, a version of Bloodlines that played more like Indigo Prophecy.

-Matt

GC_Hias · 10-12-2005, 01:43 PM

Hi Matt,

I didn't mean to be too harsh about your criticism and am sorry if i came across that way. I just thought Vampire was not the best target to go after when it comes to bashing RPGs and thus felt like rushing to its side. Compared to others i felt it worked more or less intuitive. Stuff like the sneaking skill making your movement less noisy or conversational skills giving you more dialog options. Compared to a lot of other RPGs in my opinion must seem borderline esoteric for an outsider. (what the heck do you imagine a mana boost to be?)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajon

However, I think there's a much higher probability of them being turned away from Bloodlines than, say, a version of Bloodlines that played more like Indigo Prophecy.

That's certainly right but at the moment i think Indigo Prophecy is pretty much the only game out there that manages to be intuitiv to such a degree. Hopefully that will change a bit in the future.

cheers,
Hias

Sajon · 10-12-2005, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wrba

I didn't mean to be too harsh about your criticism and am sorry if i came across that way. I just thought Vampire was not the best target to go after when it comes to bashing RPGs and thus felt like rushing to its side.

Well that's fair. I certainly wasn't "choosing" Vampire as an example of esoteric RPG conventions and then bashing it. I was just trying to explain why I personally was frustrated with some of the gameplay. If that comes off as a criticism of the whole genre, of which Bloodlines may not be the worst offending example, that's unfortunate. It was just my honest reaction to the game.

Quote:

That's certainly right but at the moment i think Indigo Prophecy is pretty much the only game out there that manages to be intuitiv to such a degree. Hopefully that will change a bit in the future.

I dunno. Lots of games do... or at least they used to. Indigo Prophecy's "innovation" is bringing the intuitive, standardized interface of 2D adventure games into 3D. It's like the Scumm engine for 2005. That's nice, but not revolutionary. And I don't think you need to do what Indigo Prophecy does to be accessible and intuitive accross a range of fictional content. GTA is no less accessible than Indigo Prophecy gameplay-wise (it's probably more accessible, imo.)

-Matt

GC_Hias · 10-12-2005, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sajon

I dunno. Lots of games do... or at least they used to. Indigo Prophecy's "innovation" is bringing the intuitive, standardized interface of 2D adventure games into 3D. It's like the Scumm engine for 2005. That's nice, but not revolutionary. And I don't think you need to do what Indigo Prophecy does to be accessible and intuitive accross a range of fictional content. GTA is no less accessible than Indigo Prophecy gameplay-wise (it's probably more accessible, imo.)

I guess mostly they used to. Scumm is a great example. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying that Indigo Prophecy is revolutionary in what it does, but it's approach to, control- and otherwise, offer sth. for a very broad market is rather unique at the moment. Nowadays most games are about tweaking details in already über-specialised niches. Like RPGs. I think you are point is absolutly right.

Hias