New Review Posted: Gran Turismo 4

Daniel Weissenberger · 09-01-2005, 01:42 AM

I review Gran Turismo 4, and reveal still more reasons not to get into a car with me:

"I always enjoy it when I'm able to learn something about myself when playing a game. It can be something as simple as, "Gee, throwing people through windows sure is fun," or as complex as "in a post-Cold War world, I'm more than a little uncomfortable playing a game where I shoot Russian soldiers." If Gran Turismo 4 taught me one thing, it's that I'd be quite a good driver if it wasn't for all those corners."

I discuss the actual game here.

Spokkersan · 09-01-2005, 08:23 PM

You write the review from the point of view of someone who does not like hardcore sim racing games. People who enjoy arcade racing probably know what Gran Turismo is like and will most likely streer clear of the game. The review is worthless because the game wasn't targeted to you anyway.

Not being able to feel the true sensations and feelings of driving have nothing to do with a game that costs $50 dollars. I don't know why you are faulting it for that. Buy a thousand dollar simulator.

If you played the GTR games on the PC you'd say the same thing. Yet people spend hundreds on racing wheels and peddals to inch ever closer to realism. They wouldn't feel anything more than the rumble of the steering wheel but because they are hardcore simmers they love it.

The game isn't for you buddy.

Daniel Weissenberger · 09-01-2005, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spokkersan

The game isn't for you buddy.

I thought the review made that abundantly clear

Spokkersan · 09-02-2005, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GC_Danny

I thought the review made that abundantly clear

Then why review the game? Shouldn't a person who likes realistic racing games review a realistic racing game?

You wouldn't assign a review of NBA Live to a guy who hates basketball would you?

I really like Game Critics despite the fact there are a shitload of pop-ups, intrusive advertising, and it's barely updated. The reviews really give you a different side of things that you won't get at IGN or Gamespot.

But every so often there's a review that's so out there that I just don't understand where the reviewer is coming from.

The Destroy All Humans review slammed the game because aliens invade Earth for no other reason than to kill humans? Who is thinking about that when they are deciding whether or not to buy a game called Destroy All Humans?

The Dead or Alive Beach Volleyball review blasted the game for it's portrayal of women. WHY DO YOU GET A FEMINIST TO REVIEW THIS GAME? The game is marketed to men, and yet a lot of women ended up enjoying other aspects of the game.

The point is I love Game Critics but some of these reviews are a real head scratcher sometime.

And for the record I don't even like Gran Turismo. I rented it because I wanted to check out the graphics and that was that.

Brad Gallaway · 09-03-2005, 01:30 AM

Then why review the game? Shouldn't a person who likes realistic racing games review a realistic racing game?

personally, sometimes i find value in hearing the opinion of a person who is not a devotee of the genre/style/series of what is being reviewed. Your mileage may vary.

The Dead or Alive Beach Volleyball review blasted the game for it's portrayal of women. WHY DO YOU GET A FEMINIST TO REVIEW THIS GAME? The game is marketed to men, and yet a lot of women ended up enjoying other aspects of the game.

so which one was a feminist? Me or Erin?

Daniel Weissenberger · 09-03-2005, 02:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spokkersan

The Destroy All Humans review slammed the game because aliens invade Earth for no other reason than to kill humans? Who is thinking about that when they are deciding whether or not to buy a game called Destroy All Humans?

I slammed Destroy All Humans for being a bad game - I also took issue with the fact that it revelled in cruelty and sadism to a degree that I found disturbing.

Similarly, the point of my review of GT4 was not that I dislike real driving simulators, but that GT4 had failed at its goal of being 'the real driving simulator'.

Chi Kong Lui · 09-03-2005, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spokkersan

I really like Game Critics despite the fact there are a shitload of pop-ups, intrusive advertising, and it's barely updated.

Two pop ups on average per visit is a "shitload" of pop-ups? A skyscraper to the far side on the right and standard banner ads at the top and bottom are intrusive?

So what do you consider the half page ads that you see on IGN and NY Times?

Chi

David Stone · 09-03-2005, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GC_Brad

The Dead or Alive Beach Volleyball review blasted the game for it's portrayal of women. WHY DO YOU GET A FEMINIST TO REVIEW THIS GAME? The game is marketed to men, and yet a lot of women ended up enjoying other aspects of the game.

so which one was a feminist? Me or Erin?

Man, did I have a good laugh at that one. It sure as hell ain't Erin.

It's all about perspective. If Danny is able to say why he isn't a racing sim game person, then backs it up in the review in the form of why sim racing doesn't feel right (which he does, noting things like the handling), the real problems of the game (the lack of crash damage) and why it didn't feel like a proper simulator in the first place (the tactile feedback of driving). I've never understood the GT series as games. I understand them as beautiful physics models, and certainly when I first got my PS2, I would leave the demo running and have my father ask, "What channel is that?" just for fun. That's why this site is its own interesting little piece of work. Normally magazines give their fighitng games to the fighting game guy, the shmups to the shmup guy and the RPGs to the RPG guy (etc. on the genres, and substitute "guy" for "gal" when applicable). And certainly, each of the critics has their own particular niche of games they love. But I think that Danny's review was quite cogent in its arguments.

Asz · 09-03-2005, 06:48 PM

I would actually like to see more reviews like this. If you can get somebody who normally doesn't enjoy a certain genre, to like a game of that genre, then the game must have succeded very well.

EnduroGamer · 09-06-2005, 02:27 AM

The problem with getting someone who doesn't like a particular genre to review a game in that genre is that there is a lack of knowledge at work that makes the review worthless to those interested in that game. Especially when it's a niche.

If you're going to review a game like GT4, you need to have someone with an understanding and thorough knowledge of the series -- and its competition -- make poignant remarks as to how this game measures up and where it doesn't. Not somebody who just moans about the game not being for him.

But of course this is where the convenient, "well those people already know what they want can read about it elsewhere" remark will be made, as it has in the past. And to that I call bullshit.

Just another reason why this site has fallen from the top of my Favorites list.

Quote:

As a result, driving becomes less about intuition and skill and more about rote course memorization, which is considerably less of a "Real Driving" experience than I'm sure they were hoping to create

This is so ridiculously wrong, it's not even funny. Danny, have you ever done any auto racing? Do you honestly think it's about intuition? Drivers WALK the course over and over to MEMORIZE the course. They study maps of the course. The practice lap after lap to INGRAIN the course in their minds.

And, by the way, you talk of GT4 being unforgiving. WTF? The game allows you to crash into other cars and walls with no repercussions. For your sake, don't play Enthusia, Forza, CMR, or any game that is actually a real sim--you'll only find it too hard and not enough fun.

I guess you find it hard to believe, but people do find fun in the challenge.

Daniel Weissenberger · 09-06-2005, 02:52 AM

Well, of course there's a strong memorization element in race driving - I can't imagine even completing the Black Forest course in a race without driving it fifteen or twenty times to practice first. My point of complaint was that there's nothing else to the game - the whole thing is just a series of time trials with no real competitive aspect, which isn't like real race driving at all.

And yes, the game is unforgiving - but to its credit, it does allow you to cheat and exploit its lack of a damage engine, if you so choose, but that's not the same thing as being balanced in the first place.

It's not like these are new problems to the series - I've suffered through them in each previous GT title as well. Who knows, if one of those other Racing Sims has decent AI and more realistic driving conditions, I might actually prefer it to GT4.

jwe8k · 09-06-2005, 12:34 PM

I think this is a perfect opportunity for the Gamecritics "dual review" system to shine. The other person to review the game should be a racing sim fan. That way you can see what someone who's a fan of the genre and someone who's not thinks, the latter being more of interest to me as someone who hasn't played many racing sims.

As for the criticism of aspects of the game that are inherent to the genre, those do come in handy for those who would be turned off by things like that. Racing fans can ignore them.

If there was to be only one review, however, it should definitely come from the fan of the genre.